Curse

Ec]-[oMaN · Mar 09, 2008, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Maybe the KD isn't too usefull, still though it prevents what ever caster that was just interupted to re position him self for those 2 seconds...

twicky_kid · Mar 10, 2008, 12:21 AM // 00:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zuranthium

If Aftershock sees play, it will be on midline E/A's that spike with a Warrior (or perhaps a pure Ele spike team build...but Aftershock absolutely shouldn't be put on a Warrior).
~Z

KD/aftershock wars were popular a very long time ago in TA. That was back when TA was used as training grounds for split teams in gvg.

Since the meta is mostly split I wouldn't be surprised if it popped up again for split teams to spike with. Will it be worth it? Who knows until some one tries and and everyone copies it on obs.

People are so damn closed minded until a top team does it.

wuzzman · Mar 10, 2008, 01:23 AM // 01:23

since when the meta is mostly split? I wouldn't bet on anyone bothering with a dedicated split build till the next monthly.

Greedy Gus · Mar 10, 2008, 02:16 AM // 02:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

KD/aftershock wars were popular a very long time ago in TA.

Will it be worth it? Who knows until some one tries and and everyone copies it on obs.

It's just not worth 10 energy, the spec, or the skill slot. "Who knows" style reasoning doesn't apply here.

Zuranthium · Mar 10, 2008, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

KD/aftershock wars were popular a very long time ago in TA.

Yeah, back when we didn't understand the game very well. People did a lot of dumb crap in 2005.

~Z

Phe Belladona · Mar 10, 2008, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Almighty Zi

Regarding Psychic Instability, I like this skill now as interupting any skill every 10 seconds is pretty hot, however, I have found the KD effect to be pretty pointless. I was looking for skills that it could work nicely with. I tried Waste Not Want Not (definately getting the energy from a KD foe) and then decided it was more worthwhile just taking the usual p drain. I then looked at Lift Enchantment and then realised that it was touch range (grr) - now that would have been a nifty combo. I then tried it with Awe but that seemed a bit too gimmicky and pretty ineffective.

Seeing as you don't really benefit from the KD 95% of the time, you have to wonder why you would take this as your elite when you could just take Cry of Frustration instead now that this is also 10 energy (the correct cost of the spell imo). Ok, CoF recharges 5 seconds slower but it is non-elite and to all intents and purposes does the same thing.

My suggestion would be to rework the skill slightly to be an elite skillful version of shame/guilt. I was thinking of something like this: 'If target foe is casting a spell or chant that foe is interupted and hexed with Psychic Instability. For 4 seconds, if target foe casts a spell that targets someone other than himself or performs a chant (or shout?), that foe is knocked down'. You'd definately then have to change the recharge to at least 15 if not 20 seconds, however, even in this incarnation although it can only interupt spells/chants and perhaps only recharge in half the time, I think that it would be a more useful elite.

i dont think its worth the elite but it can still interupt through mantra of concentration and other "uninteruptable" skills as the KD serves as an interupt that cant be avoided.

Kwisatz_Haderach · Mar 10, 2008, 03:28 AM // 03:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

It's just not worth 10 energy, the spec, or the skill slot. "Who knows" style reasoning doesn't apply here.

no but it was popular for a very long time because without nf and factions that was one of the best skills to place on a hammer warrior.

needless to say i can not see aftershock coming back on warriors because of the reasons you mentioned and because Holy strike and its clone completely outclass it.

However, you can not say that AS will be completely ignored because i have seen some pretty deadly spikes using it and as mentioned before it could be a nice way for an ele spike on midline.

However, all of this requires further testing in light of the recent update so the "Who knows?" mentality is completely appropriate.

Robster Lobster · Mar 10, 2008, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phe Belladona

i dont think its worth the elite but it can still interupt through mantra of concentration and other "uninteruptable" skills as the KD serves as an interupt that cant be avoided.

This is not correct, the knockdown effect only occurs if the skill is interrupted. The same applies to Simple Thievery.

Almighty Zi · Mar 10, 2008, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Robster is correct.

Legendary Shiz · Mar 10, 2008, 04:34 AM // 04:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phe Belladona

i dont think its worth the elite but it can still interupt through mantra of concentration and other "uninteruptable" skills as the KD serves as an interupt that cant be avoided.

Bad mesmer

465465432196489456

Master Ketsu · Mar 10, 2008, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Just to name a few key points:

Augury of death: A decent nerf. the additional recharge was needed. Overall GJ anet on this one.

Siphon speed: Overnerf. 20 second recharge ( 10 with condition ) I can see, but a 30 second recharge just makes it a crappy lead. The skill was OP because of its effect for cost and time, but beyond that it wasn't that bad.

Mystic regen: it's a fine nerf, doesn't really kill it. The problem is that regen itself is underpowered and this was really the only "good" non elite regen skill other then troll. Rather then nerfing Mystic-r it would make more sense IMO to buff the other regen skills to meet its standard.

Psychic instability: Knockdown is good, but after an interrupt it becomes nothing more then a minor bonus. Needs more.

Wail of Doom: Fail. Once spike teams learn how to exploit this it will show its face on just how OP it is. 2 monk teams would get owned. Make one monk worthless with this: then spike the other monk. Way too easy.

Magehunters: another good one. Now I'd say warrior hammer builds have more then just a few basic build's. The buff makes it good but not too good.

Overall: Meh. I can't shake the fact that alot of izzy's idea's sound irritatingly similar to those of QA tester new-hires who have barely gotten into a game with a strong meta-balance to it yet. If Izzy want's any hope of every balancing this game he needs to stop this "Oh if its overpowered Ill just up the cost/recharge/effect ridiculously" mindset and actually get into figuring out WHY alot of these skills are overpowered.

langola · Mar 10, 2008, 05:11 AM // 05:11

Magehunters and mokele might need a slight tweak, they seem just a bit to good.

Zuranthium · Mar 10, 2008, 05:22 AM // 05:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kwisatz_Haderach

no but it was popular for a very long time because without nf and factions that was one of the best skills to place on a hammer warrior.

However, all of this requires further testing in light of the recent update so the "Who knows?" mentality is completely appropriate.

Bull's Strike and Prot Strike sucked back then.

The "who knows" was only referring specifically to Aftershock on Warriors.

We know it won't happen again. At least in some large way.

~Z

Greedy Gus · Mar 10, 2008, 05:34 AM // 05:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kwisatz_Haderach

no but it was popular for a very long time because without nf and factions that was one of the best skills to place on a hammer warrior.

It was not. KD/AS was just a simple synergy that was easy to see & use, and was carried into popularity by that ease of use, terminology, and understanding (in the heavily PUG environment of 05), not by its effectiveness. Aftershock on hammer wars is probably one of the classic examples of early popular simple synergy-based skill usage that gave way to bringing more useful and powerful tools.

wuzzman · Mar 10, 2008, 05:36 AM // 05:36

if you have to lock a monks infuse to get off a spike then your better off running a mesmer, or even better your better off running balanced.

MasterSasori · Mar 10, 2008, 05:39 AM // 05:39

This update had quite a bit of changes.

Some stuff like "Watch Yourself!" and RI needed the balancing.

I'll sure miss abusing Crip shot and Mindblast though >.>

Riotgear · Mar 10, 2008, 06:13 AM // 06:13

Kind of a minor nitpick, but Magehunter's needs to be changed to the standard hammer KD animation.

twicky_kid · Mar 10, 2008, 06:18 AM // 06:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

It was not. KD/AS was just a simple synergy that was easy to see & use, and was carried into popularity by that ease of use, terminology, and understanding (in the heavily PUG environment of 05), not by its effectiveness. Aftershock on hammer wars is probably one of the classic examples of early popular simple synergy-based skill usage that gave way to bringing more useful and powerful tools.

The dmg is there but energy is a problem.
Go with holy strike.

The only time it'd be worth it is with an earthquake on the spike. More of an HA build. Energy still sucks no matter what though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

Kind of a minor nitpick, but Magehunter's needs to be changed to the standard hammer KD animation.

OMG yes. I tried using it and my timing was all off because of the animation.

C2K · Mar 10, 2008, 08:02 AM // 08:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

Kind of a minor nitpick, but Magehunter's needs to be changed to the standard hammer KD animation.

QFT.

It totally threw me off the first few times I saw it used, I wasn't ready for it lol.

kvndoom · Mar 10, 2008, 10:40 AM // 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

Kind of a minor nitpick, but Magehunter's needs to be changed to the standard hammer KD animation.

Sign here:

http://guildwarsguru.com/forum/showt...php?t=10264254